HyperKat Support and Tester Forum
Mars Challenger V1.0 => Mars General Discussion => Topic started by: Hank on April 05, 2010, 12:50:12 PM
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I don't know in detail, but I believe Mars' atmospheric pressure is around 0.5% compared to earth atmospheric pressure. Wouldn't this low pressure kinda "damp" all noise that there is? Could one really hear the drill is operating or the loud boom of a GPR-shot (wich are one of the rare sound events in the demo)? I can imagine you could here the storm outside when you are sitting in the habitat since the windspeeds are pretty high, in fact that sounds cool in the demo ;D
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As a historian, my physics is awful, so excuse me if I sod this up completely!
My understanding of this is that the sound would not be "dampened" so much by a low atmospheric pressure as it would slowed, so sound would likely take a lot longer to reach you than it would on earth, but as far as I know there is little to quieten it down at all. Additionally, the speed of sound is far less affected by air pressure than it is by the temperature of that air, sound being "transferred" between vibrating gas molecules which have far less energy to vibrate (and therefore do so less quickly) when that gas is cold. And Mars is cold. Really, really cold.
So! In answer to your (implied) question, no. I think that the sounds on Mars would be roughly the same volume as they are on earth, but would reach you far slower as a combined result of the low air pressure and the low temperature of the red planet.
Apologies if that's utterly wrong.
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Sorry but I believe you are utterly wrong... I am fairly certain I saw on TV with one of the science shows they put an alarm clock in a bell jar, and as they removed the atmosphere the sound attenuated.
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Actually looked it up on youtube and there is a video of it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce7AMJdq0Gw
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Ya Ok, So sounds would be late/faint/or not at all on Mars depending on persons persective, relative to the sound.. But that would make for dull game with zero sound, Myself I would like to hear strange, echo-y, space/sci-fi sounds. To give creepy atmoshepric sense. I talking humming HABs, strange distant winds, crackled, distorted radio chatter- more the better in MHO, for me sound effects are important to a game (think BF2:BC)
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Info I dug up on the sound was, inside the hubs it would be nornal due to pressure and air density. Outside since the density is low then the sound volume would be low. Sounds would transfer to our EVA gear however and get back to a air density and volume level. So inside the suit we would hear all the sounds of the suit.
Now having said that being inside a closed container the sounds we did get from the outside would be a bit different. Put yer head in a barrel and the barrel will amplify the sound somewhat and alter it a bit. So until someone goes there in a pressurized eva suit we wont realy know for sure. In any case sounds will be in the game for nothing more then ambience but there will certainly be sound on Mars.
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BTW: there should be a "heavy breathing" sound when stamina is low. Something like that: http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/display/sounds.cfm/sound_group_iid.476 (http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/display/sounds.cfm/sound_group_iid.476)
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If you're standing anywhere near the drill and, especially, the GPR shot, you'll hear it through ground transmisison. Similar to mortar-launched fireworks: if you're right next to the 8" tubes, you'll not hear much through the earplugs, but, if you're outside the anular dead section RIGHT next to the tube (due to the charge going off a couple feet below ground level), your feet'll get slapped some. Not sure how it'd sound through an EVA suit, but you'd definately hear it.
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Thanks for all your quite logic considerations. I guess Hyper pointed it out, the suit/helmet works like a membrane, while atmospheric conditions will make noises sound faint in general. I like the sounds as they are now, giving a little ambience overall. One thing I definitely miss is radio chatter (as there are no AI-astronauts), but you could probably have it when playing online ;)
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I would like to think groups would start using ventrillo, or teamspeak for this. Chatter is essential...
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Well I once heard that the question arose something like this. Does a falling tree in the woods make a sound if no one is present to hear it? Well can you hear a explosion on Mars if you are not there? So maybe it doesn't make sound when you are not there. Did the Big bang make sound? We were not present at the time but maybe we could ask the scientist observing it as we are living it we are just in their super collider right now living the whole ting out in real time. Maybe we can check with the scientific Giants Later. rofl ;D
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Well I once heard that the question arose something like this. Does a falling tree in the woods make a sound if no one is present to hear it? Well can you hear a explosion on Mars if you are not there? So maybe it doesn't make sound when you are not there. Did the Big bang make sound? We were not present at the time but maybe we could ask the scientist observing it as we are living it we are just in their super collider right now living the whole ting out in real time. Maybe we can check with the scientific Giants Later. rofl ;D
If NOTHING hears a tree falling in the woods, there is no sound..
If no one hears it, it is not sound. It is just pressure waves. In order for something to qualify as sound it has to be interpreted by a brain somewhere.
*Kinda like Schrodinger's cat experiment.. if he didn't overlook a key observer.... The cat!
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no one as in a human or nothing as in a animmal? what if a rabbit heard it? or what about a sound that out of humans frequency range lieka dog can hear? But we can't is that also not a sound? ;)
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Correct, it would have to be NOTHING, not just no humans. And if a dog could hear it it would still be sound.
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Unfortunately you can never really prove that kind of negative. Just because you can't find anything doesn't mean there isn't something there.
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I agree, I know a girl who is deaf. But she loves dancing, I asked her (she can lip read) how can you dance if you can't hear? she signed out (her friend can read sign language) she can feel the vibrations.. ergo: pressure waves,vibrations,sounds..
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Yep! ;D
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I agree, I know a girl who is deaf. But she loves dancing, I asked her (she can lip read) how can you dance if you can't hear? she signed out (her friend can read sign language) she can feel the vibrations.. ergo: pressure waves,vibrations,sounds..
Of course, but to her there is no sound.
She feels the vibrations but she does not translate them into sound. If there existed no other organisms near a bell except her, She could feel the vibrations of it, but the bell would make no sound.
Because it must be translated by something to be considered a sound.
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Yes you are right.
But becouse somebody cant hear it don't mean the sound don't exist- but agree if a sound is heard by nobody then I guess the sound could not be proved it happened. But the disturbance in the air, the pressure wave did happen.
LOL I love the posts on these forums..
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Yes you are right.
But becouse somebody cant hear it don't mean the sound don't exist- but agree if a sound is heard by nobody then I guess the sound could not be proved it happened. But the disturbance in the air, the pressure wave did happen.
LOL I love the posts on these forums..
Absolutely, the pressure waves happened, they existed, but pressure waves are not sound, they are what we translate as sound..
To Further clarify though...
Kinda think of it this way.. Radio waves, infrared, and visible light are no different other than their frequency, but since we cannot see the other ones, we do not call them colors or normally include them in light even though they should be. The frequencies we cannot hear are called "Subsonic" or "UltraSonic" Meaning quite literally "Below Sound" or "Above Sound" because without the ability to translate them into sounds they are not sound, they are pressure waves. Now yes, they are sound to certain creatures, but once again it does require the actual hearing of it to become a sound.
Proving it happened is not the requisite for it becoming sound, the actual hearing of it is. IE: Even though they call them "Sound meters" They do not "hear" they simply measure. Sound is a subjective thing and it is entirely dependent upon the observer, or observers, and techniques like perceptual encoding that happens in MP3's allow the same sounds to be generated by different air moment patterns than the original.
An MP3 on an oscilloscope would look VERY different than one from a raw concert or a wave file, and has massively different pressure changes, HOWEVER they SOUND the same, because the compression throws away pressures we can't hear, due to it being near another pressure level and it saves massive amount of space.
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Fair comment ;D
It makes for good debate,. and all that from a post about the sound in MCO ;)
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Hehehe. It is a great game =)
I think we collect a massive number of really intelligent people here because of its subject matter as well.
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Hehehe. It is a great game =)
I think we collect a massive number of really intelligent people here because of its subject matter as well.
Yep indeed, and will be all the better with more ambient sound,.. Now If there was a sound in MCO and I was AFK when it happened, did it really happen?
ROFL Joking!
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Wait a second!?
If I hear a sound in my head (that no one else heard) is it also a sound?! ;D
There are no preasure waves, yet if I can hear them it means they egsists! Is that right by your logic? ;D
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Wait a second!?
If I hear a sound in my head (that no one else heard) is it also a sound?! ;D
There are no preasure waves, yet if I can hear them it means they egsists! Is that right by your logic? ;D
Correct.
In fact there are many conditions in which humans here sounds where there are no pressure waves. And yes they are sounds, Tinnitus comes to mind, where people here a ringing in their ears constantly, however hearing things due to mental illness may also be sounds that exist to that person.
But just because it cannot be recorded, does not mean it is non-existent. I am sure people who have fibromialga, and suffer from it significantly will assure you the pain is real... Even if there is no actual trauma to the tissue layers.
Whats important is the act of being interpreted by the brain.